Blonde Frog (of Frog God Games) posted the piece below on the G+ thread I had mirroring this post from the Tavern about The Razor Coast Kickstarter.
It is an excellent eye opener for the behind the scenes stuff that goes into a project of this type and the costs involved.
I present it here with Blond Frog's express permission.
"We priced the book accordingly to the price tag we are being charged. The ridiculously priced art that Nick bought back in 2008 had to be paid plus replacement art added for contracts that had come due. The original pre-orders all have to be paid. The printing costs are high because we can't and won't print 10,000 books like Paizo. The more you print, the cheaper a book becomes. Our textbook binding is the highest in the industry and thus costs more than a stapled or glued backing but we feel it is worth it as we want our games to last.
The book will retail (if funded) at $100. The extra $10 on KS is to cover the shipping. We don't make very large profits at all on these books. Artists and writers make the most. My pay from frog god games last quarter broke down to $3 a hr. So you, the customer, aren't getting ripped off here - I PROMISE THAT.
As for Nick, the book itself is very good. The writing is superb and the adventure is exciting. The sandbox feel gives you unlimited play which you just don't get from an AP (and yes $120 for Skulls and Shackles vs $100 for RC but once you are done with Skulls & Shackles you aren't going to play it again. RC you can play until you just plain get worn out). There is value here, and lots of it. Some amazing people have come on board to support this project because it is worth supporting.
As for using Kickstarter, we don't see it as a pre-order platform, we see it as it is meant to be. A way to raise funds for projects we wouldn't otherwise be able to do. There is no way we could afford to do this without the support of Kickstarter. Our previous KS "profits" ALL WENT INTO the projects they supported. Those funds are the reason we could offer the bonus goals and additional books. So trust me when I say we aren't pocketing thousands of dollars and laughing all the way home from the bank. Quite the opposite. We pour long hours into these projects and as a company barely break even.
Negative feeds like this make us question why we do it at all when we don't even get paid minimum wage for it. So I just ask that everyone keep that in mind when judging whether they feel this book is worth the price tag. We do feel it is worth it, otherwise we wouldn't have picked it up. But we can't do it alone.
We don't plan to run every project as a kickstarter, only those where we need it. This is the perfect example of a project needing the help to see the light of day. I hope for those who enjoy a GREAT adventure will take another look at the kickstarter. We will be posting more sneak peeks too which might help change your mind about the writing and value. Plus if we fund and go over we can and will add more value to the pledges so EVERYONE gets more for their money. That's called sharing the wealth, not pocketing it for ourselves. ~Blonde Frog"
Is that a wereshark on the cover? :)
ReplyDeleteIt sounds as if it's a nice product - but it's a $50-$60 product. It just doesn't seem to be economical for Frog God to make this product at a reasonable price point, because the costs are for a Big Industry Production but they are a little company with a small print run. I guess if the Kickstarter can fund it, great - I wouldn't expect they'll sell a lot at $100, though. Paizo don't sell collated APs for $120; Rise of the Runelords is under $60.
ReplyDeleteSo the retail price of a 250 page book is going to be $100?
ReplyDeleteSomewhere I think Necromancer Games and Frog Gog went off the rails, wanting to be the Rolls Royce of d20 rather than "1st Edition" feel. While I don't really like the DCC RPG, at least his heart is in the right place.
Am I the only one that gets tired of hearing rattle like this from companies? PRICE POINT IS EVERYTHING for a small company that wants to compete with the big boys. It bothers me to hear the old guilt trip that a company is doing me a favor by selling their product. It's role reversal- I am actually doing them the favor in purchasing said product. I am the demographic they should want to please. That means a product at a reasonable price, of reasonable quality, in a punctual time frame. A company has to figure out how to do this if they want to stay afloat. You can't rely on good will and happy horse crap indefinately. Listen to your customers.
ReplyDeleteI agree. If the art cost too much then go black and white and use old necromancer art.
DeleteI think an adventure has to run itself for that price..
ReplyDeleteGod I hate this whining.
ReplyDeleteDoes anyone complain that a Bentley is more pricy than a Ford?
Don't buy it if you find it to expensive. But stop complaining that a full color 250 page product with art by some of the "stars" of the industry is more expensive than your 60 page b/w adventure with clipart.
Are you driving a Bentley? If so, I'd give some credability to your comment.
DeleteNope, but I pledged 150 USD for this kickstarter. I is very expensive, but I am willing to pay for it.
DeleteMy above Comment was not very diplomatic. So I apologize for the tone.
What I wanted to say: Don't buy it if you think it is to expensive.
I hope you really get your Bentley and not a Bentley paint job on a Ford chasis. More power to ya.
ReplyDeleteThat is the risk of this kickstarter. But so far Frog God Games has put out high quality stuff (IMHO). And I know Razor Coast back from 08' as I was one of the first to preorder it from Sinister Adventures in 08'.
ReplyDeleteBut if it is crap I can still try to find some Fanboy on ebay to cut my loss.