Where to start?
Holy shit, this is one hell of a train wreck.
I give Nystul credit for admitting where and when he fucked up. Ken? Douchbaggery and then some.
Need examples? I'm going to quote from the KotDT Live Action Series Kickstarter comments:
(From Josh who plays the role of Brian in KODTLAS. Ken was supposed to fly Josh to GenCon to be at the premiere but broke that promise.)
--So this is what I just got from Ken.....--
Ken: J.Hey Josh, yeah. I could not raise the money. Jolly has pretty much fucked me from making money. It's a total fuckery. Anyway, I'm sorry, I thought I could pull out of this one and make it happen. Sorry brother (Notice how Ken tries to scumbag Jolly?
This was my response....
Josh: I have to disagree man. I don't see how Jolly made you squander that money and screw us all out of this project. I really hope that if future episodes get made, we don't get recast because of our association to the fuckery that was last summer's shoot. I really hope you can get those 3 episodes to him. The fans and backers that have put so much into this project deserve it. There's two ways out of this mess. You man up and give what you've got to the fans so that Jolly and Barb aren't left holding the bag and save some face or you tuck tail and run. I would highly advise against the latter. The people who believed in you and supported you are owed more respect than ignored messages. The fans deserve the first three episodes and the actors who want nothing more than to bring this project to life, deserve the first three episodes. I'm really hurt at the way you're treating them. It's not right man. I know you have your own side to the story, but you have to get it together. You made a promise. Stick to it. I'm not talking about flying me up. I'm talking about the episodes. Release them for Gen Con. You had a gift the fans gave you and you wasted it on looking good or making big promises. Real art isn't about that man. Film making is not about that. It's about the work. It's about creating something and not getting caught up in the money. They didn't give you that money to buy a chrysler 300 M so you could look like a producer. They gave you that money so you could create something. It's the only right thing to do. We deserve better!
--Feel free to post that response!--Nice little inside peek at the mind of the man who admitted that he does serial Kickstarters because he squanders the money from the previous ones.
But wait! Theres more! Buy now and you can watch how Jolly and Barbara get booted from the Facebook page of the KotDT Live Action Series for advocating for the backers of this very Kickstarter:
Jolly - Well I tried folks. Ken is not talking about the premiere at all. No invitations to the premiere have been sent out. None of the actors to my knowledge are going to be at the premiere (no fault of their own - mostly due to failure on d20 Ent's part to make proper arrangements). Ep2 and Ep3 were in very rough shape last time I saw them. No idea what's going on since Ken refuses to even give me answers. And for asking publicly his response booting me from the group and deleting my questions and those of other backers. Guess we're all going to show up at GenCon and be surprised.Wow. Simply fucking wow.
But hey. At least the backers at $450 are going to get front row seats to the Premiere, time with the actors, a Q&A and an after party, right?
Jolly - So Ken just posted this apparently;But wait. Ken still hasn't emailed those Premiere tickets, has he?
"All three episodes of KODT will be premiered at Gen Con in various states. They are not done, and a work in progress. (this shit was supposedly done earlier this month I thought)
We are working on having them done, and ready for download in August.
We will then produce and ship the DVDs as soon as we can.
For those of you with Premiere tickets, there will be a second line at the show for you. You will be seated first.
There will be no actors at the show and therefore no Q&A, and there will be no afterparty. Sorry for the problems."
'various states"...?
No after party?
NO Q&A.
Ken you are a coward. Face the backers and answer their questions at least face to face at the premiere.
Now, I'm not calling Ken Whitman a crook. He gets upset when folks label him.
Instead, I'm going to give y'all a textbook definition of a crook.
Crook - a dishonest person, especially a sharper, swindler, or thief.
Oh, and then there is this ;)
This is such an enormous clusterf*ck that words fail. F*ck him for ruining Kickstarter for those who gave their hard earned money to this and for those of us who work hard to make crowdfunding be a net positive for the community. I am not even a backer and I am furious.
ReplyDeleteWhat a mess.
ReplyDeleteI guess my question is what is anyone surprised about this? Ken has been screwing people since Mutazoids. How does he keep doing business with people in this industry?
ReplyDeleteI backed his Knight's Quest card game...Actually received a product after many false updates and lies on that one..What did I learn? 1. Never back anything involving him again. Really feel sorry for the people who have walked off the pier on his current projects.
ReplyDeleteThis is no surprise though, is it? I don't trust kickstarters at all, but when Ken's Traveller project, "Spinward Traveller," was announced, I did a little google-fu on him. Burnt my fingertips, the keyboard got so hot. Even with Marc Miller's endorsement, I ran the other way. Stay away from that guy.
ReplyDeleteI have nothing but respect for Jolly, but I blame him for this. He should have done his due diligence. As already pointed out, there's plenty of evidence on the internet that this would have happened.
ReplyDeleteIts amazing how many individuals and their companies have been absolutely destroyed by Kickstarter fuckery. For every one-man success story (Zach Glazar, Greg Gillespie, Jeff Talanian, Kevin Crawford, etc) you have just as many Ken Whitmans, James Mals, Centerstage Minis, Brave Halflings, Myth and Magic, Mike Nystuls---people who will probably never work in the industry again and have left it a more paranoid, less trusting and angrier place. More harm has been done than good.
ReplyDeleteFuck Center Stage.
DeleteIf you are a backer, contact yours or his (whichever is appropriate) state's attorney's office and see what your legal options are. Also keep in mind there may be federal repercussions for taking money from people in other states and countries.
ReplyDeleteDon't let him get away with it. Go after him!
Who knew KS was destined to be the feeding ground of the snake oil salesman?
ReplyDeleteI wonder if this Ken guy is one of those "strongly charismatic" charmer types, because he seems to be able to con some people into supporting him who I would think should know better (Jolly, Miller).
Ken is.....he definitely is.
DeleteYeh, don't forget Larry Elmore either.
DeleteDid something happen with one of Elmore's kickstarters? I was in for the first one and while it was late (6 months I think), they were constantly in touch with the backers and the end product was everything promised and I was quite satisfied. Has something happened that places him in the "con man" category?
DeleteKen was "helping" Larry and while I'm not sure what all happened, I do know he started spamming Larry's backers with email about his projects and he used Larry's name a bit too liberally with his own projects, like promising a Larry Elmore poster for the KoDT:LAS backers.
DeleteAsk Larry about his association with Whitman. Save time for the 30 minute profamity filled tirade to follow.
DeleteWait, did this guy really buy a 300 with his Kickstarter funds? Normally I'd assume that was a joke comment, but with this project Im not so sure...
ReplyDeleteArgh, this damned blogging software keeps eating my responses (this is my fourth time typing this in).
ReplyDelete-
I just went back to re-read the trainwreck threads from Ken's RipoffPOD (RapidPOD) company crashing and burning and taking down several small RPG companies with him.
Jolly read and commented on that thread. He was made aware of how much of a ripoff artist Ken is. And yet he still went into business with him.
WHY THE FUCK?
(And I just got a follow-up from Jolly about this very question - seems Ken bamboozled him with a "changed man" act.)
DeleteWhat is needed, and I've already reached out to a well-known/respected and more importantly like-minded industry artist is a unifying graphic that we can collectively use as a simple "Don't Give Ken Whitman Another Dime" banner.
ReplyDeleteOne of the underlying issues is not enough people knew about Ken's fuckery. Hell, I've known Ken since 1996 and all this wasn't known until after my wife pledged $450 partially based on my minor vouching for Ken.
We need to make this stuff known! Make it so Ken Whitman's name shows up as a con-artist on the 1st page of Google! Undoubtedly he'll try to resurface and try something "new" in a few years. We need to make sure his stink follows him wherever he goes to the point where he has to change his name instead of just the name of his "company".
He has that Castles & Crusades project too..I wonder what involvement etc. their company has on that one..seems it's a dead in the water project too..
ReplyDeletehttps://www.kickstarter.com/projects/d20e/castles-and-crusades-blacktooth-ridge-tv-pilot/comments
July 21st he posted on Facebook that Spinward Traveler was coming soon, and some other blurbs about that late project coming up (Due December 2014)
ReplyDeleteMaybe got distracted editing the wrong thing with Gen Con looming.
I haven't commented or posted anything to his pages on purpose, but now I too have been removed from friends list.
Shall I also mention that he also promised to show the Spinward Traveler on July 30 at Gen Con?
ReplyDeleteThus far I have yet to be burned on Kickstarter, but I have a few projects out there that are reaching their "deadlines." I feel for all those got burned. I feel sorry for those who didn't know better and I feel "are you kidding me" for those who knew the history and still backed a lamprey.
ReplyDeleteYou have truly reached maximum fuck-up when Hitler goes off on you.
ReplyDeleteAlthough, I'll give Ken this. He's making Dave Boggs looks a whole lot better. Yeah, I paid $30 for a PDF instead the print books he quit mailing but at least:
1. I'm out less than 10% of what a lot of Ken's backers are out.
2. I got the PDF.
Just a quick comment — someone pointed out Dyson Logos' comments. Specifically about my knowing of Ken's reputation prior to this kickstarter. Yes - guilty as charged. Years ago during the rapid pro thing I read a lot of things about Ken/Rapid Pro and his not delivering on product. Couple of things in the 7/8 years since. Ken went away. Ken came back personally apologizing to several folks in the industry (including myself - though he'd never personally wronged me to my knowledge) and armed with a story about how he had been undiagnosed ADHD which destroyed his marriage and many many friendships. Ken claimed he'd been on meds, getting counseling and that he was keenly interested in rebuilding his rep, making amends and becomgin a 'new man'. I know I'm not the only gaming industry type to be approached with this Ken 2.0.
ReplyDeleteAnyway Ken invited me and my wife down to Kentucky in 2013 to watch the shoot of Brothers Barbarian Season 2. I had seen BB1 on youtube and knew Ken had pulled that one together. I was impressed by the number of people who managed to bring together to knock out these projects. And I quite enjoyed BB season 1. While on set I met a LOT of people who were hard working, professional and just all around great people. I'm still friends with many of them today. I also got to know Larry Elmore and some of the actors who would later work on KODTLAS. Ken was the center of it all.
Long story short, I left that shoot thinking Ken had changed. He was producing something. I really thought that perhaps he had finally found his niche — making quirkly little film projects.
Fast forward a bit, when Ken approached us about KODTLAS my first response was that it was going to be a hard sell to my partners. They knew of his reptuation a bit. And we weren't sure he could pull it off. So Ken went out and did a proof of concept piece based on an obscure two page KODT strip (where Brian and Weird Pete are talking in the game store). It was perfect but the casting was dead on and we saw the potential. Looked like Ken had a great feel/appreciation of the property. He'd completed two seasons of Brother Barbarian (though we didn't know at the time he would never deliver finished/edited episodes of BB2) so it appeared he might actually know what he was doing. So we granted him a license and he proceeded with his kickstarter.
Yes, I was taken in. So were the actors involved, the cinematographer, the crew and virtually everyone else Ken worked with. Unless you've met Ken personally or hung around with him it's hard to explain the charm/charisma this guy has. I've known people who have fallen for his 'new man' routine many times over the years. It's an ability he has.
At GenCon this year while I manned the booth I was shocked as person after person came up with "Ken screwed me too" stories. I'm not really proud of the fact I was duped by this guy. Nor am I happy that others gave him money based on our granting him a license.
Well, Jolly, I take he's made his final mistake. Not only did he screw over one of the nicest guys in the industry, that guy's partner is an attorney. Or so I've heard it said. :)
DeleteCome on people, live action series, screening at Gen Con, Q&A, after party...even with all the money raised you know it's going to go down in disaster as Ken Whitman promised too much. Who can accomplish all that with a kickstarter campaign? I would daresay this is a classic case of wanting something good, fast, and cheap and from experience you can only have at the most two out of the three.
ReplyDelete