When all you do is lie, when you suddenly come clean and tell the truth, it's almost too incredible to believe. Yet the evidence is clear, Ken Whitman lost / misplaced / broke two 4 TB hard drives that contained KotDT: LAS and possibly other videos from other Kickstarters BEFORE Gen Con 2015 and the KotDT Release Party.
The attempted shakedown of Kenzer Co for an extension to Ken's contract at the end of 2017 in return for the HD video? All bluster. There WAS no video. It was already gone.
The court case is basically done. There is nothing to be recovered.
Huge thanks to Louis Desy - without you, we'd never have closure. Without you, Kenny would still be lying.
Link to latest court update: https://iapps.courts.state.ny.us/fbem/DocumentDisplayServlet?documentId=nWcYcjVwzRXtn7pcdY4bDQ==&system=prod
From Louis Desy (highlighting is me):
If we assume that Whitman is lying about the files being gone, but no one can get him to tell them what he wants to turn the raw footage over, none of anything going on makes sense.
BUT once we realize that Whitman is telling the truth to some people at times about the files being gone, then everything he has done and is doing makes perfect sense.
It also explains why no matter what I did over the months, including offers of money, I could never get Whitman to name a price or say what he wanted to turn over the raw footage. Why? Because if Whitman named a price, and I said OK, and sent ZOE to make the transfer, it would have been discovered that Whitman had been lying about having the raw footage and lying to make it look like he was holding it hostage.
It is also why Whitman only told me late yesterday afternoon the number of devices and what happened to each. Whitman figures, as I did, that the case was going forward and it was going to now come out that he was lying about still having the footage shortly. If Kickstarter PBC had filed their appearance and motions several hours earlier yesterday, and Whitman had seen them, Whitman would have continued to refuse to detail the number of devices and what happened to each. On this I got lucky in how the timing played out plus Whitman start to cave on the court issue. Where last week Whitman was telling me that 'I want you to have to drive to court in New York', then on Monday, after I had given up on getting either defendant to do anything on appearing in person for about the Preliminary Conference, Whitman is all of a sudden calling the court clerk about arranging a telephone conference for the Preliminary Conference? Whitman is 'crying' in his filings that his car can't make the trip and he is so broke that he can't afford the trip, yet still will not try to get money for transferring the files? This is probably the most sincere and truthful any of us have ever seen Whitman in a long while. Whitman was not telling a 'sob story' in the hope of getting the court to agree to a telephone conference, his car is probably really not suitable for any long distance travel and Whitman was starting to fear that the case was going to require personal appearances in New York at some point and he was not capable of such a trip, even later this year, in all probability.
As more examples of how 'the files are really gone' makes sense and answers the questions as to why Whitman is acting the way he does:
1: Offer of ZOE to make the transfer. ZOE had a standing offer to make the transfer whenever Whitman would agree to allow that to happen, They even offered to have someone drive to where the files were and make the transfer. All of this was going to be FREE to Whitman, BUT Whitman refuses to let this happen and will not tell anyone anything he wants, why?
Answer: Because the files are gone. Whitman can't agree to this because ZOE would find out the files were gone.
2: I try for months to get Whitman to say what he wants, but Whitman never says anything definite or keeps making excuses as to why and how he can't do a transfer to anyone and talks in circles all the time on issues, why?
Answer: Because the files are gone. Whitman can't tell me what he wants, because if I give it to him, I will find out the files are gone.
3: I ask Jolly plus Kenzer and Company if Whitman wants anything. There are reports that Whitman wants to sign another contract but that Whitman wants to bar Jolly plus Kenzer and Company from talking about the project for five years, plus who knows what else, why?
Answer: Because the files are gone. Whitman has to name terms that Jolly plus Kenzer and Company would never agree to because if they did agree, they would find out the files are gone. Whitman also asks for something that makes little to no sense, what difference does it make it if Jolly or Kenzer and Company talk about the mess, over 3,000 people know and it is all over the place, yet somehow one is to believe that it would really help Whitman if they stopped talking (if they do at all) online about the project? Plus, once it came out that the files were gone, any talking online by Jolly or Kenzer and Company would pale in comparison to the fact that Whitman lost the files.
4: Whitman is offered 20 hours per week to work on the project by Marcus King, at Marcus King's expense, but Whitman turns King down, why?
Answer: Because the files are gone. At least for KODT:LAS, Whitman CAN'T work on that project because he does not have the files anymore. If Whitman takes Marcus King up on the offer, eventually Marcus King will wonder why no progress is being made on KODT:LAS, which Whitman can't make any progress on if there are no files to work with.
5: Whitman is asked multiple times by various people but changes his answer as to whether or not the files exist, why?
Answer: Because the files are gone. Whitman can't have people believing and knowing that he is so incompetent that he lost files that can not be recreated, but he can't just out and out tell everyone they are gone, Whitman has to be evasive as to whether or not they exist so no one is really sure of the status of the files. Which makes no sense when it is clear Whitman is broke but will not even name a price to transfer the files, but DOES make sense once you realize the files are gone and Whitman CAN'T deliver the files for any amount of money!
6: Why doesn't Whitman try to negotiate a price for the transfer of all of the raw footage?
Answer: Because the files are gone. If Whitman names a price, and someone meets that price, they will find out Whitman does not have the files anymore.
So a big Kickstarter project, $70k plus whatever he got afterwards, and the guy doesn't even invest a few hundred into simple backup?
ReplyDeleteThat was one of the problems in my thinking.
DeleteAll this time I automatically assumed that Whitman would not be so incompetent as to NOT have a second backup of all the files at all times.
Now we find out the truth is that Whitman so mishandled the safeguarding of that device that no can even be sure when the last drive was lost, sold, or gone.
Plus it looks like Whitman's friend or 'his friend' that lost or sold the drive is Ed Kramer.
Wait.... Does he still HAVE the original 4TB hard drive, which locked up? What's the going rate for professional drive recovery services?
DeleteI don't have a position on whether or not anyone should seriously consider that option, I'm just curious as to whether or not it IS an option.
No, Whitman lost both 4TB drives prior to Gencon 2015.
DeleteI posted a message and a document with the court over the weekend, but on Saturday I found out that any device that might have had footage was left with a friend of his over three years ago. One of the devices was the dead 4TB and the other was, at the time, a still working 4TB drive.
Whitman then went off for some months. While the devices were with the friend, the friend got evicted from his apartment. Whitman contacted the guy later and the guy said he didn't remember seeing anything when he moved out.
I talked with a person on Saturday that had first hand knowledge of the stuff. Apparently, up to a year ago, it was all stored in a barn, along with some film/movie making props. About a year ago the barn burned down and everything was completely destroyed.
So, if Whitman had said something as little as a year ago, the devices could have been tracked down and maybe ok, but after the fire everything was destroyed and they are gone.
Incompetence at its worst. What a complete moron.
ReplyDeleteI'm not clear Louis. If you don't mind my asking, what exactly happened today?
ReplyDeleteDid Ken actually come clean to you or was this all just your supposition? I ask because the Ken Whitman we all know is most likely simply going to claim that you withdrew the suit because you had nothing, and/or because Kickstarter and he got it dismissed (like his earlier boast yesterday).
I'm guessing Ken didn't show. I'm guessing attorneys for Kickstarter didn't show either(but, hey, I've seen crazier things happen in court...)
Did he communicate to you that he lost the files by phone or email? And then you withdrew? I'm asking because I didn't see anywhere in the papers where it states that he actually told you himself that he lost them. Section 1 comes close but doesn't explicitly state that.
I get it if you make that guess. It makes sense. But Ken's a pathological spinmeister and we all know how he's going to spin this.
One of the exhibits added today is an email chain between Louis and Ken. In it, Ken says that one 4TB drive “locked up” and he left the backup 4TB drive with a friend. Ken’s friend was evicted, and after moving, the backup drive was nowhere to be found.
DeleteEmmett, Kenny's admission is in Exhibit AB, which is emails from Kenny to Louis dated July 30, 2018, where Kenny explains what happened to the drives and the files. Then Louis' following Memorandum summarizes what Louis has determined from all of the preceding evidence and Kenny's admission.
DeleteThanks guys! I must not have seen AB.
DeleteWhitman has confessed and was obvious once I had the admission from Whitman about the devices. It was partly because of the upcoming court dates and partly because once I realized the truth and reported it, Whitman is in very big trouble with the people around him that have been helping him with everything he put all of them through because of his lies all these years.
DeleteReading the whole court update sounds like a sad "Well, we tried, but in the end, he's going to get away with it all through sheer incompetence." How in a case like that he can't at least be sued in a way that has him working for life to pay back the fleeced Kickstarter backers, I don't understand, but I guess that's the end of this part of it? He'll be back cursing everyone else in the world for causing all his problems before too long...
ReplyDeleteThis can't be the end. There's no way he's going to be able to get away with it again. $200k gone and Whitless escapes scott free.
Delete"Working for life..." doing what, exactly? Who in their right mind would pay this man even to move rocks from one place to another?
DeleteWell, we know what happened to the footage, and now I am seeing if I can find that, so it is not over yet. After that, well . . . lets see what else happens first.
DeleteRemember, everything I did so far was only civil.
@azmountaintroll:
Delete"doing what, exactly? Who in their right mind would pay this man even to move rocks from one place to another?"
Court-enforced restitution is a thing. Someone is required to have a job (or go to jail), keep the job (or again, go to jail), and then provide some reasonable percentage of his earnings to those he's damaged (or again again, go to jail). I know this wasn't a criminal suit, but this would be the only reasonable endgame at this point to actually feel like something good happened - Ken has to work for the rest of his life (or however long it takes) to give every non-essential penny he makes back to those he's caused damage to, or he goes to jail. People have embezzled a lot less than Kenny in their life and had to either do this or face jailtime, there's no reason we should spare one of the lowest forms of life on earth the same choices.
I do not think this situation is 'all over' by any shot. While people had already noticed what was going on here since Whitman stole from over 2,000 people plus multiple reports to various state and federal agencies, it looks like 'the system' is starting to take notice.
DeleteWhitman mentioned to me that when he was trying to get approval for the phone conference that one of the people he talked to at the courthouse made the remark 'oh yea, the Kickstarter case'. That is somewhat of a surprise that the case was gaining notoriety plus the documents are on the docket forever for anyone in the world to look at and see what an outrage it is.
I think people within the system are going to start taking a look at it, especially start to ask, "How did Whitman pay takes on a company that did not exist?"
Therein lies the rub - Kickstarter does not withhold taxes when it pays out. Does ANYONE think Ken paid taxes on ANY of his Kickstarter projects?
Deletewanted to add one thing after talking to my wife about this. All of Ken's comments about how we all were ruining his life by hounding him for the KickStarter rewards for KODT: LAS. That is all now entirely on him ... not any of us. A single moment of honesty in that meeting with Kenzer at Gen Con 3 years ago that he skipped out on would have meant a firestorm ... but one that would have died out. Stuff happens to KS projects ... people lose their money ... turn the page. He knew at Gen Con 3 years ago that he could never deliver this project and instead decided to go on a rampage of personal attacks against multiple people for years rather than tell anyone a single moment of truth. It also means he really did pocket almost all that money from all the KS projects. No idea what he did with that much cash ... but I'm guessing less than half of it actually went to any of the 6 projects. Guy has played the victim card so much ... but yeah ... today ... I realized more than ever .... its a bed he totally made for himself and kept remaking every day for the last 3 years.
ReplyDeleteThat is the big problem. If Whitman had confessed as to what was going on as soon as he knew, people could have at least tried to do something and had a chance to save everything.
DeleteInstead Whitman ran around yelling at everyone and caused all kinds of chaos when the truth is that the footage was all gone, which would have NEVER happened if he had made a proper backup. If Whitman couldn't afford to do that, someone, I am sure, would have done something to help and safeguard the raw footage.
Instead Whitman runs around yelling at everyone when they ask, "What is going on" or threatens them for talking about it online?
I am only able to find out once I go through the whole process of a court case and it starts to get near to the dates for court dates and even that was a near thing.
If the lawyer for Kickstarter PBC did not wait until the last possible day to file their answer, and didn't do it a few hours before the day running out at 9pm, Whitman would have never fessed up to anything and would still would be evasive about whether or not the footage even existed.
Well, I got a message to Ed Kramer so lets see what I get back.
Maybe on top of finally finding out what happened to the raw footage I will be able to perform 'one last miracle' in 'The Case of The Lost Footage' of finding any of the devices and retrieving the lost footage!
Wait, it gets better.
ReplyDeleteThe 'friend' that had the hard drive and was lost in an eviction from an apartment, I think 'the friend' is Ed Kramer!
Yea, THAT Ed Kramer!
Whitman think that 'his friend' may have lied and sold all of Whitman's hardware for cash. If it is Ed Kramer, Kramer got kicked out of Dragon Con July 2013 and probably was running out of cash a while later, so the timeline fits.
Whitman comes and stayed for a while when he ran from Kentucky to Atlanta with Ed Kramer; and Kramer is probably 'the friend' Whitman left his stuff with.
I made an inquiry this morning with Ed Kramer to ask if he has any information on the devices and the raw footage.
NOT Ed Kramer.
DeleteThe reason Whitman is providing information, even without the case, is because I suspect the people around him, even supporters, are all in shock as to what everyone went through because of his lies going back years and he is in BIG trouble with all of them.
ReplyDeleteNormally, with the win in court, Whitman would be running around and boasting about how smart he was and did nothing wrong. But, as you see, Whitman does NOT dare do that since the people that supported and helped him are all probably very upset with his lies for all these years. Plus the incompetence in not backing up the footage and losing everything for ALL of the Kickstarter projects is truly what has done it for a lot of people.
As an update, I am GLAD to report, the 'friend' is NOT Ed Kramer.
DeleteI didn't invest much into the KODT:LAS Kickstarter. However, I Have backed close to 300 other KS by now. In total, I've contributed A LOT. A whole lot.. (ask my wife... lol!)
ReplyDeleteI thank you Louis for pursuing this, because it's cases like this that help the entire crowdfunding sector be legit (mostly) knowing that, when push comes to shove, there's gonna be people like you who will stick up for backers. We all know (or should know) going into a KS that you may not get anything. It's not a store. However, we DO expect due diligence from the creators to at least not be morons with our money, and to be honest.
Thank you sir.
One more point in all of this, that may not be entirely clear, the devices contained all of the files for all of the projects, so Whitman lost the Traveller footage also on the devices when they went bad/missing/lost/sold.
ReplyDeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
DeleteI reached out to Ken with an offer to get the deck dice KS fulfilled for him. Waiting for a reply now.
ReplyDeleteI thought Deck Dice was "fulfilled," and that it was the pencil dice project(s) that were crapped upon.
DeleteHe has not fulfilled a single kickstarter he has run.
DeleteYep, I see that now.
DeleteI don't get it, is they guy a narcissist, what's the advantage, or benefit in not admitting the truth? The whole thing, just seems really bizarre.
ReplyDeleteI think the problem is that Whitman was still trying to get film/movie work back around the time of Gencon 2015. After Whitman fled Kentucky for Atlanta it looks like he was working with some actors group there. It would have hurt his ability to get work if it came out that he lost all of the footage on multiple projects, so Whitman hid that from everyone and hoped that no one would ever figure it out, and it almost worked.
Delete"it almost worked"... It did work unless he has to pay something back to someone. This is just the end of the cycle and he'll come up with something else within a year or 2.
ReplyDeleteWhich is why we need to see what the next step is the legal system.
DeleteAccording to the Traveller KS, Ken acknowledged the following in the risks section:
ReplyDelete"Movie making is a crazy business, with a lot of unknown factors. We start with a script, assemble the best team possible, get insurance, get everything approved by Far Future, and make contingency plans. It's impossible to guarantee everything will come together exactly as planned, but in the end, we will have created a movie that hopefully all of us can be proud of."
Take a particular read of the 'get insurance' part...
Film Production and Completion Insurance covers loss of media. Did Ken actually have Completion Insurance? Did he get a payout for the loss of files?
Additionally, the 2 backers with the Primary Extra Package (at $1000 each) were "guaranteed" to show up in the Final Cut of the Film. As there is no 'Final Cut', and no possible way for a Final Cut to be completed now, do they get their money back? (that's kinda the meaning of GUARANTEE...)
In a follow up to this, all be it 2 years later, Ken is claiming he is sending the Traveller files to Marc Miller this week. He is also claiming that he never said that he losty them, just did not have the money to finish the project. So if all the files were on those two 4 TB HDD, where did they come from. I can also only assume his contract is up so he is hoping Marc will finish the project. All a bit odd.
ReplyDeleteI'm a little late to the game as I was looking at a similar Traveller deal on FB called "Far Trade" and was wondering if that was what I had backed so long ago. It was actually Ken Whitman's Traveler project. Skimming all this, my question is, how does anyone know there were any files to lost? This sounds more like a guy who serially created projects, took in money because the funding goals where low, and then didn't do anything.
ReplyDeleteWhitman did do some work on some of the projects. Back in 2015 Whitman did show some of the files at conventions, including Gencon, and I think, maybe Origins.
ReplyDeletePre Gencon, Aug 2015, Whitman did show clips from Knights of the Dinner Table at another convention or two. Some of the people in the audience noticed some spelling mistakes (ex: "Port Raided" instead of "portrayed") and mentioned them to Whitman. (Whitman is infamous for spelling and grammar mistakes.) At another convention, around mid 2015, some of the same people saw Whitman show the same clips and mentioned to him he had not made any corrections. Whitman assured people that corrections would be made, but at this point some people 'had the sinking feeling that Whitman had lost the footage', and the reason for no corrections was that Whitman was no longer able to make them.
I did not find out about this viewings with errors going uncorrected until near the deadline for the Whitman to file an answer in the lawsuit in 2018. Once I was told about one of the people having the 'sinking feeling that Whitman had lost the raw footage' I knew what happened and when confronted with the truth, with the threat of the lawsuit still ongoing, Whitman finally confessed to the truth. Both 4TB hard drives were lost. Whitman did not even know where they were; I had to contact people that he use to deal with in order to find out what happened to the abandoned by Whitman 4TB drives. EVERYTHING was on the drives.)
The mistake I made throughout the entire process is that I never even considered the possibility that Whitman has lost all of the raw footage. Whitman could have asked anyone to set up a dropbox link, or other FTP service, and had all of the footage saved automatically every time there was new footage; instead he left it on only two 4TB drives. Whitman never said anything when one locked up, and then left the other one behind when he 'took off' from KY to avoid demand letters or process servers.